4th of July

[Gene Clem]

Ideas for an Independance Day rally:

o Picnic for family
o Food vendors
o Oration contests
o Constitution quiz bowls
o Are you smarter than a 5th grader history quizes
o Organizational discussion groups
o Issues discussion groups
o Sack races
o Balloon toss
o Fireworks

......Can we do it?.........

[Michael Pelletier]

I believe we should post the different specifics that are the basis for our rally. The name T.E.A. (taxed enough already) is really about the deluge of taxes about to descend upon us due to the out-of-control ridiculous spending of our money by congress and our president. Then there's the bail-outs of failing companies. The take-over of businesses. The "spreading the wealth" taking from wage earners and handing our earnings to sloths. These come to mind ... but I certain there are other things along these lines which should be listed.

[Tia Gazi]

Michael Pelletier said:

I believe we should post the different specifics that are the basis for our rally. The name T.E.A. (taxed enough already) is really about the deluge of taxes about to descend upon us due to the out-of-control ridiculous spending of our money by congress and our president. Then there's the bail-outs of failing companies. The take-over of businesses. The "spreading the wealth" taking from wage earners and handing our earnings to sloths. These come to mind ... but I certain there are other things along these lines which should be listed.

You know one thing that seems obvious, but that people apparently have forgotten is that Tax Money is actually money that we have earned. I know that that is blindingly obvious, but at the same time, there really does appear to be people that have no idea that the Government gets its money by taking it away from people. They don't understand that when politicians talk about either raising or cutting Taxes what they are really doing is deciding how much of your money you may be allowed to keep. I wonder if there is a way to convey to people that it isn't selfishness to want to keep as much of the money you make as possible. I know its not counterintuitive. But for some reason it is a concept that is not universally understood.

[JLB]

Good News! I have found a Michigan Drum and Fife Corp. See their website at: http://www.geocities.com/pfdc_2000/pfdcnews.htm

Their calendar looks pretty full but possibly, depending on our schedule of events, something may be workable. I think it is worth checking into.

[Tia Gazi]

My Pastor is the president of the Acton Institute which is a multifaith think tank on liberty and the Christian presence in the public square. Here is a link to their site.

http://www.acton.org/

His name is Fr. Robert Sirico and he sometimes appears on the BBC as a comentator. I wonder if we could speak to him about giving a talk or having an acton institute table at the Fourth of July gathering?

[Tia Gazi]

Also was re-reading the Declaration of Independance yesturday, and after having read Gene's post containing the letter from McCarthy to Eric Holder, I think it would be timely if we were to have a reading of the Declaration either at the begining or end of the speeches. The Declaration is a stirring call to arms for liberty and a worthy document to re-peruse from time to time to remind us all how truely important the call to liberty is, and how much we should be willing to sacrafice for this cause.

We should choose someone who is a fairly decent orator (wink wink Gene) and have that person read out the full Declaration.

[Gene Clem]

Tia Gazi said:

My Pastor is the president of the Acton Institute which is a multifaith think tank on liberty and the Christian presence in the public square. Here is a link to their site.
http://www.acton.org/


His name is Fr. Robert Sirico and he sometimes appears on the BBC as a comentator. I wonder if we could speak to him about giving a talk or having an acton institute table at the Fourth of July gathering?

I agree with this statement from their principles:

Rule of Law and the Subsidiary Role of Government - The government's primary responsibility is to promote the common good, that is, to maintain the rule of law, and to preserve basic duties and rights. The government's role is not to usurp free actions, but to minimize those conflicts that may arise when the free actions of persons and social institutions result in competing interests. The state should exercise this responsibility according to the principle of subsidiarity. This principle has two components. First, jurisdictionally broader institutions must refrain from usurping the proper functions that should be performed by the person and institutions more immediate to him. Second, jurisdictionally broader institutions should assist individual persons and institutions more immediate to the person only when the latter cannot fulfill their proper functions.

[Jan Novak-Voeltzke]

It is necessary that we be very very careful of whose philosophy is intertwined with the movement we are now engaging in. Many organization sound and seem very compassionate and good, but intertwined in them can be Socialist/Communist/Marxist philosophy/ideology. I know this to be a true fact. Some seem extremely good, but unless one has the background and ability to review the mission and purposes and variety of bacground information to ascertain whether an organization is truly True Conservative, we need to proceed with extreme caution. Having studied the "Cristian" Socialist/Communist/Marxist Movement and having family members deeply involved in them, I can tell at a glance the subversive language used by them. There will be wolves in very appealing sheep's clothing trying to infiltrate our precious moement--so it demands scrutiny when others are allowed to speak. So very much sounds so very good---SocialismCommunism/Marxism sounds wonderful ("Witness" by Whittaker Chambers is a "must read") and particularly the Social Justice and Liberation Theology with the churches today which is why so many denominations have unknowingly been pawns in the SCM ideology today. They have no idea what is behind their "social justice/liberation theology" organizations within their church. They are blinded by the "so-called human(ist) compassion" lies that are within the Socialist movements merely to "sucker them in" for hidden agendas and purposes to overtake our Nation---WHAT WE ARE EXPERIENCING NOW AFTER 40 YEARS OF THE INFILTRATION OF OUR DENOMINATIONS AND PUBLIC GOVT. SCHOOLS. But in reality, they are the very ones who have caused what we are dealing with today. I know! I've watched and heard first hand. for 40 years. So, a word of caution and also a word to investigate such organizations and movements deeply before they are allowed into ours.

Gene Clem said:

Tia Gazi said:

My Pastor is the president of the Acton Institute which is a multifaith think tank on liberty and the Christian presence in the public square. Here is a link to their site.
http://www.acton.org/


His name is Fr. Robert Sirico and he sometimes appears on the BBC as a comentator. I wonder if we could speak to him about giving a talk or having an acton institute table at the Fourth of July gathering?

I agree with this statement from their principles:

Rule of Law and the Subsidiary Role of Government - The government's primary responsibility is to promote the common good, that is, to maintain the rule of law, and to preserve basic duties and rights. The government's role is not to usurp free actions, but to minimize those conflicts that may arise when the free actions of persons and social institutions result in competing interests. The state should exercise this responsibility according to the principle of subsidiarity. This principle has two components. First, jurisdictionally broader institutions must refrain from usurping the proper functions that should be performed by the person and institutions more immediate to him. Second, jurisdictionally broader institutions should assist individual persons and institutions more immediate to the person only when the latter cannot fulfill their proper functions.

[Tia Gazi]

Jan Novak-Voeltzke said:

It is necessary that we be very very careful of whose philosophy is intertwined with the movement we are now engaging in. Many organization sound and seem very compassionate and good, but intertwined in them can be Socialist/Communist/Marxist philosophy/ideology. I know this to be a true fact. Some seem extremely good, but unless one has the background and ability to review the mission and purposes and variety of bacground information to ascertain whether an organization is truly True Conservative, we need to proceed with extreme caution. Having studied the "Cristian" Socialist/Communist/Marxist Movement and having family members deeply involved in them, I can tell at a glance the subversive language used by them. There will be wolves in very appealing sheep's clothing trying to infiltrate our precious moement--so it demands scrutiny when others are allowed to speak. So very much sounds so very good---SocialismCommunism/Marxism sounds wonderful ("Witness" by Whittaker Chambers is a "must read") and particularly the Social Justice and Liberation Theology with the churches today which is why so many denominations have unknowingly been pawns in the SCM ideology today. They have no idea what is behind their "social justice/liberation theology" organizations within their church. They are blinded by the "so-called human(ist) compassion" lies that are within the Socialist movements merely to "sucker them in" for hidden agendas and purposes to overtake our Nation---WHAT WE ARE EXPERIENCING NOW AFTER 40 YEARS OF THE INFILTRATION OF OUR DENOMINATIONS AND PUBLIC GOVT. SCHOOLS. But in reality, they are the very ones who have caused what we are dealing with today. I know! I've watched and heard first hand. for 40 years. So, a word of caution and also a word to investigate such organizations and movements deeply before they are allowed into ours.

Gene Clem said:

Tia Gazi said:

My Pastor is the president of the Acton Institute which is a multifaith think tank on liberty and the Christian presence in the public square. Here is a link to their site.
http://www.acton.org/


His name is Fr. Robert Sirico and he sometimes appears on the BBC as a comentator. I wonder if we could speak to him about giving a talk or having an acton institute table at the Fourth of July gathering?

I agree with this statement from their principles:

Rule of Law and the Subsidiary Role of Government - The government's primary responsibility is to promote the common good, that is, to maintain the rule of law, and to preserve basic duties and rights. The government's role is not to usurp free actions, but to minimize those conflicts that may arise when the free actions of persons and social institutions result in competing interests. The state should exercise this responsibility according to the principle of subsidiarity. This principle has two components. First, jurisdictionally broader institutions must refrain from usurping the proper functions that should be performed by the person and institutions more immediate to him. Second, jurisdictionally broader institutions should assist individual persons and institutions more immediate to the person only when the latter cannot fulfill their proper functions.

Having known the President of the Acton Institute personally for a long time I can assure you that he is commited to conservatism and hasn't a communist/socialist/marxist bone in his body. He is an intellegent, honest, and forthright person of deep convictions and vast experiance in the public square. There are many organizations and people we may do well to avoid, he is not one of them.

[Jan Novak-Voeltzke]

I understand that you have known this man/organization for a long time. But in the days that we are living in--and believing the scriptural exhortation to "test the spirits", I would have to KNOW what this person believes with regard to Social Justice, Liberation Theology, Illegal Immigraiton/LaRaza Movement, Environmentalism, Manmade Global Warming, Evolution, etc. We cannot just introduce people into our midst without "testing the spirits." The above groups are vouched for solidly by a faction of the Catholic Church---yet they are all strong hard-working spokes of the Socialist/Communist Movement. I know whereof I speak---I have family members (nun and ex-nun) who travel nationwide and world-wide promoting these factions--plus in doing so--"reforming the entire national and world educational system. We need to know deeply what organizations and their people are all about. I checked the Acton web site and though I didn't get a chance to delve deeply into their philosophy, I saw enough that raised signals to me. We all need to be careful and rely on each other's wisdom and knowledge and be willing to "learn" some new things. I would ask this person his thoughts and beliefs about the above. I hope this helps in understanding my concerns and does not offend you or anyone else. I believe God's Holy Spirit has allowed me to know some deep meanings of our times--over the decades--that will be welcomed by some and refuted by others who may not wish to believe them. Nonetheless, I have a duty to explain and give knowledge that I have learned over the decades--I would feel very remiss in not doing so. Thanks.

Tia Gazi said:

Jan Novak-Voeltzke said:

It is necessary that we be very very careful of whose philosophy is intertwined with the movement we are now engaging in. Many organization sound and seem very compassionate and good, but intertwined in them can be Socialist/Communist/Marxist philosophy/ideology. I know this to be a true fact. Some seem extremely good, but unless one has the background and ability to review the mission and purposes and variety of bacground information to ascertain whether an organization is truly True Conservative, we need to proceed with extreme caution. Having studied the "Cristian" Socialist/Communist/Marxist Movement and having family members deeply involved in them, I can tell at a glance the subversive language used by them. There will be wolves in very appealing sheep's clothing trying to infiltrate our precious moement--so it demands scrutiny when others are allowed to speak. So very much sounds so very good---SocialismCommunism/Marxism sounds wonderful ("Witness" by Whittaker Chambers is a "must read") and particularly the Social Justice and Liberation Theology with the churches today which is why so many denominations have unknowingly been pawns in the SCM ideology today. They have no idea what is behind their "social justice/liberation theology" organizations within their church. They are blinded by the "so-called human(ist) compassion" lies that are within the Socialist movements merely to "sucker them in" for hidden agendas and purposes to overtake our Nation---WHAT WE ARE EXPERIENCING NOW AFTER 40 YEARS OF THE INFILTRATION OF OUR DENOMINATIONS AND PUBLIC GOVT. SCHOOLS. But in reality, they are the very ones who have caused what we are dealing with today. I know! I've watched and heard first hand. for 40 years. So, a word of caution and also a word to investigate such organizations and movements deeply before they are allowed into ours.

Gene Clem said:

Tia Gazi said:

My Pastor is the president of the Acton Institute which is a multifaith think tank on liberty and the Christian presence in the public square. Here is a link to their site.
http://www.acton.org/


His name is Fr. Robert Sirico and he sometimes appears on the BBC as a comentator. I wonder if we could speak to him about giving a talk or having an acton institute table at the Fourth of July gathering?

I agree with this statement from their principles:

Rule of Law and the Subsidiary Role of Government - The government's primary responsibility is to promote the common good, that is, to maintain the rule of law, and to preserve basic duties and rights. The government's role is not to usurp free actions, but to minimize those conflicts that may arise when the free actions of persons and social institutions result in competing interests. The state should exercise this responsibility according to the principle of subsidiarity. This principle has two components. First, jurisdictionally broader institutions must refrain from usurping the proper functions that should be performed by the person and institutions more immediate to him. Second, jurisdictionally broader institutions should assist individual persons and institutions more immediate to the person only when the latter cannot fulfill their proper functions.

Having known the President of the Acton Institute personally for a long time I can assure you that he is commited to conservatism and hasn't a communist/socialist/marxist bone in his body. He is an intellegent, honest, and forthright person of deep convictions and vast experiance in the public square. There are many organizations and people we may do well to avoid, he is not one of them.

[Cynthia Gustafson]

I like Tia's idea of having the Declaration of Independence read at the 4th of July celebration. I think it would have a unifying effect. I think Jan has a point about being careful who we associate ourselves with. On the negative side, if someone turns out to be something we're not proud of, that can be hard to live down. But even if the person or organization is 100% and there's nothing to regret at all, associating with different organizations can have the effect of watering down our own message. Also, if we associate ourselves with various groups, it makes people wonder, why do we need the Tea Party anyway, aren't they just like that other group? I think we should save our endorsements for the candidates we choose to back, and other than that keep ourselves focused on who we are and what we want to accomplish.

[Tia Gazi]

LOL, well fortunatly I am not on the commitee who is picking speakers, so other then throwing out ideas I will leave it to Jack.

[Jan Novak-Voeltzke]

Cynthia you express my opinion nicely. Thanks.
Cynthia Gustafson said:

I like Tia's idea of having the Declaration of Independence read at the 4th of July celebration. I think it would have a unifying effect. I think Jan has a point about being careful who we associate ourselves with. On the negative side, if someone turns out to be something we're not proud of, that can be hard to live down. But even if the person or organization is 100% and there's nothing to regret at all, associating with different organizations can have the effect of watering down our own message. Also, if we associate ourselves with various groups, it makes people wonder, why do we need the Tea Party anyway, aren't they just like that other group? I think we should save our endorsements for the candidates we choose to back, and other than that keep ourselves focused on who we are and what we want to accomplish.